WhiteCore Dev meeting Tue August 5th

WhiteCore Dev meeting Tue August 5th

August 05, 2014

Development meeting

Held on the freenode, #whitecore-support channel at 09:30 UTC I will try and post log transcripts of each meeting from now on as we are nearing the next 'freeze' and release.

Thanks to those who were up late and very early, for their contributions.

IRC chat log of the WhiteCore development meeting

Timestamps are off (and will be corrected) but for reference [05:30:00] => 11:00 UTC

[05:39:30] <Fly-man-> K, so are all the people here that wanted to be here ?
[05:39:36] <timothy_hoxley> if you want drivers and stuff already go mint
[05:39:58] <timothy_hoxley> well like over 15+ people rsvp'd
[05:40:07] <EmperorStarfinde> linux hates my graphics card LOL
[05:40:07] <timothy_hoxley> but in my experience not all yes people show up
[05:40:11] <HanHeld> It's amazing, with Mint you can *almost* use the free-software ATI drivers; they're good enough for Singuarlity (but don't work with Firestorm)
[05:40:13] <HanHeld> I'm here
[05:40:21] <HanHeld> more or less (1:40am)
[05:40:34] <timothy_hoxley> I agree HanHeld, but I still use propietary because I want shiny to work :D
[05:40:45] <HanHeld> Ditto, also vmware likes those drivers better.
[05:40:50] <timothy_hoxley> after all I have ADHD ooo shiny!
[05:41:35] <HanHeld> Speaking of ADHD...about all I can remember is that I applied fixes from Greythane and was able to load oars and terrains finally.
[05:41:55] <HanHeld> I tested something else for him, but can't remember what that wass off-hand; it wasn't transferring items across regions (never got arund to that)
[05:42:09] <Fly-man-> K, this is an easy meeting
[05:42:11] <timothy_hoxley> yeah and I discovered that infinite regions were never removed, just how estates work changed and well yeah
[05:42:17] <Fly-man-> as long as not everyone yells over each other
[05:42:19] <timothy_hoxley> we need to talk about documentation
[05:42:23] <Fly-man-> then we can keep it brief and simple
[05:42:28] * HanHeld way too tired to yell :3
[05:43:03] <timothy_hoxley> go ahead and start off us off fly
[05:43:49] <Raider73> im here sort of!
[05:43:56] <Fly-man-> k, as many have seen
[05:44:00] <Fly-man-> there's no Snapshot out this week
[05:44:04] <Fly-man-> there's a reason for it
[05:44:16] <Fly-man-> greythane has been busy getting all the commands in the right service
[05:44:27] <Fly-man-> and the Estate handling has hit some bumps
[05:44:36] <Fly-man-> so I will give greythane the floor to explain
[05:45:42] <greythane> ?? bumps... as far as I know it is all good.. just waiting for more eyes to find any problems that I might have missed
[05:45:55] <Fly-man-> { that's what bumps are :D }
[05:46:53] <greythane> True enough... but I have run out of ways to break it that I can think of
[05:47:10] <HanHeld> My mint box is mostly back together, in a couple days I should be able to test some stuff out, I'm not sure if I still have the patches from Greythane -your repo should be current, tho so I'm guessing that I can install the data files and then copy your repo over that?
[05:47:24] <HanHeld> and then knock stuff around, including the item-transfer thingy
[05:47:59] <greythane> I tried that today and basically found no problems.. comment on the github issue
[05:48:33] <greythane> btw.. the main 'dev' repo has all but the very latest updates, fixes and bugs
[05:49:01] <HanHeld> So it has the fixes for the oar files and terrains then?
[05:49:08] <greythane> correct
[05:50:08] <HanHeld> Cool, I'll build that and knock set up my mini-grid on it and see what happens
[05:50:15] <HanHeld> might even do that in vmware for giggles :3
[05:50:28] * timothy_hoxley prefers virtualbox xD
[05:50:57] <Fly-man-> I prefer Virtualbox and VmWare
[05:51:03] <timothy_hoxley> is there an agenda?
[05:51:03] <HanHeld> I used to, timothy_hoxley -it's more cross-platform. Today I had amazing luck running viewers in vmware player which has always been bad in VB for me (like, single-digit fps bad)
[05:51:06] <Fly-man-> both are quite good for WhiteCore
[05:51:28] <Fly-man-> timothy_hoxley: Yes, there is 1
[05:51:32] <Fly-man-> and it's in my head
[05:51:49] <timothy_hoxley> hanheld, i have pretty good performance running viewers in wine but I mainly just compile linux versions of the viewer if there isn't one already I prefer native.
[05:51:52] <Fly-man-> HanHeld: the reason you can run viewer in vmware now
[05:51:59] <Fly-man-> is the largest change they made
[05:52:07] <Fly-man-> they now let you use the real graphics card
[05:52:15] <Fly-man-> and that gets installed instead of the vmware driver
[05:52:18] <timothy_hoxley> fly-man- is there a link to it?
[05:52:29] <HanHeld> ooooh...I heard of that for Xen; it's called passthrough, isn't it?
[05:52:32] <HanHeld> Neat!
[05:52:40] <Fly-man-> Yes
[05:52:51] <Fly-man-> timothy_hoxley: No, if it's in my head, there's no link to it ;)
[05:53:01] <timothy_hoxley> lol
[05:53:25] <HanHeld> Thanks, Fly-man- that changes a lot of things for me...I'll have to do some reading. VB doesn't have anything close to pass-through afaik, I don't think it can even do it (totaly different architechture?)
[05:53:28] <EmperorStarfinde> and 2 hours after the meeting he will say oh wait i forgot something
[05:53:34] <Fly-man-> EmperorStarfinde: Nah
[05:53:42] <timothy_hoxley> Well can I bring up something?
[05:53:43] <HanHeld> me too, but I'll be talking in my sleep :3
[05:53:46] <Fly-man-> EmperorStarfinde: I also have dots written down
[05:54:01] *** timothy_hoxley is now known as Timothy_Hoxley
[05:54:12] <Fly-man-> 2nd on the list:
[05:54:17] <Fly-man-> Update
[05:54:31] <Timothy_Hoxley> update?
[05:54:32] <Fly-man-> The current state of WhiteCore is in the binding phase
[05:54:44] <Fly-man-> meaning that we want to release a working 0.9.2 version at the end of Sept
[05:55:00] <Fly-man-> so if you have anything that needs fixing or breaking things
[05:55:06] <Fly-man-> PLEASE put them in the Issue tracker
[05:55:15] <Fly-man-> if it's not in the Issue tracker, we don't know about it
[05:55:36] <Timothy_Hoxley> gotcha
[05:55:45] <Timothy_Hoxley> I will do some more extensive testing
[05:55:48] <HanHeld> ok
[05:55:51] <Fly-man-> Someone earlier asked about 0.9.2 and 0.9.3
[05:55:59] <Fly-man-> 0.9.2 is the clean up edition
[05:56:13] <Fly-man-> meaning that any left over bits that we didn't handle in 0.9.1
[05:56:20] <Fly-man-> are pushed into this 0.9.2
[05:56:21] <Timothy_Hoxley> people are impatient. I prefer release when ready rather than release schedule.
[05:56:35] <Fly-man-> 0.9.3 is the IWC / HG edition
[05:56:40] <Fly-man-> and there's no date on that
[05:56:52] * Timothy_Hoxley takes notes for Grid-Press
[05:57:21] <Fly-man-> Also, as notified on the Google+ and I will send out a message in September
[05:57:24] <HanHeld> Do you intend for it to be compatible with opensim hg, or just WSC to WSC hg?
[05:57:47] <Timothy_Hoxley> IWC is WCS
[05:57:47] <Fly-man-> October 1st will cease the support for releases 0.8 and 0.9
[05:57:55] <Timothy_Hoxley> HG is an OpenSim function
[05:58:01] <greythane> HG will be OS compatible but there will also be IWC for WC <> WC
[05:58:13] <Timothy_Hoxley> what he said ^^
[05:58:14] <HanHeld> Thanks greythane :)
[05:58:24] <greythane> WCS?
[05:58:35] <Timothy_Hoxley> WhiteCoreSim
[05:58:37] <HanHeld> I think he meant "white core sim"
[05:58:38] <HanHeld> ya
[05:58:41] <greythane> .. sorry.. forget tah.. slow tonight
[05:58:47] <Fly-man-> Haha
[05:58:48] <HanHeld> you and me both :)
[05:58:52] <Timothy_Hoxley> so whats no. 3
[05:58:55] <Fly-man-> and yes, 0.8 and 0.9 will be retired
[05:59:06] <greythane> did I miss #1?
[05:59:07] <Fly-man-> that's not 0.9.1 or 0.9.2
[05:59:11] <Fly-man-> only 0.9
[05:59:29] <Timothy_Hoxley> so your going to support two versions back?
[05:59:37] <Fly-man-> #1 was why there was no Snapshot out
[05:59:39] <HanHeld> greythane: I thot #1 was announcing that there was no snapshot this week
[05:59:54] <greythane> ah.. said I was a bit slow... :)
[05:59:59] <Fly-man-> #2 current versioning
[06:00:06] <EmperorStarfinde> its that Dr. Pepper
[06:00:10] <Fly-man-> and now the best one of the whole meeting:
[06:00:15] * HanHeld thinks everyone should be on current anyway
[06:00:18] <Fly-man-> #3 Round table questions about the current
[06:00:50] <greythane> Anyone teyong to use 0.9. will be strongly advsied to upgrade...
[06:00:51] <Timothy_Hoxley> I don't have questions about the current per-say, but I have a proposal for the project. before we get too far down the road.
[06:01:31] <greythane> Before that Tim.. let me fill everyone in on the current state of play
[06:01:32] <Fly-man-> go ahead Timothy_Hoxley
[06:02:23] <greythane> nothing heard for a bit so I'll dig in
[06:02:29] <Timothy_Hoxley> I think some sort of man(manual) pages or small wiki should be started to be maintained. I mean when the estate change happened, I had no idea I had to do my setup differently, also commands that I didn't really know.
[06:03:08] <greythane> Yea.. my fault...
[06:03:09] <HanHeld> Greythane's got some documentation on his site, and I think a wiki, Timothy_Hoxley
[06:03:10] <Timothy_Hoxley> Some sort of documentation needs to start getting compiled, weather it be an open man pages system or small wiki. I mean opensim may have bad documenation, but at least there is a way to search it kinda.
[06:04:20] <Timothy_Hoxley> I just thought I would toss that out, because its better to start now than try and play catchup later
[06:04:27] <EmperorStarfinde> the documentation could be better there is some there but definately could be more
[06:04:57] <HanHeld> I agree, I don't mind writing but I can't write what I don't know.
[06:05:12] <Timothy_Hoxley> I remember back when it was aurora-sim I asked rev where is the documentation he said look in the "docs" folder in the repo and I was like really o.o
[06:05:18] <Fly-man-> Yes
[06:05:23] <Fly-man-> That was AuroraSm
[06:05:28] <Fly-man-> and as many have seen
[06:05:40] <Fly-man-> there's also an effort in there do make a doxygen one
[06:05:53] <greythane> which works...
[06:05:54] <EmperorStarfinde> and you also didnt know there was a wiki on another domain name
[06:05:55] <Timothy_Hoxley> doxygen hm...
[06:06:08] <greythane> developer orientated though
[06:06:14] <Timothy_Hoxley> yeah
[06:06:16] <Timothy_Hoxley> what I was thinking
[06:06:27] <Timothy_Hoxley> we need something kinda more user friendly if we want adoption
[06:06:32] <HanHeld> I'd suggest documentation being a co-goal for 0.9.3; getting things in one place
[06:06:58] <Timothy_Hoxley> heck even toss up a simple doku-wiki with restricted editing, its txt file based no database
[06:07:11] <Timothy_Hoxley> what firestorm uses
[06:07:40] <Timothy_Hoxley> heck its what I use for zetamexlabs
[06:07:55] <Fly-man-> K, Timothy_Hoxley, and I will step in at this point:
[06:08:00] <greythane> I agree, documentation is needed but currently, things change daily as I see a problem and fix it.. 'Real' docs need to be done on a full release state where no more changes are going to be applied.
[06:08:03] <Fly-man-> How many developers does Firestorm have ?
[06:08:23] <Timothy_Hoxley> huge ammount of devs
[06:08:24] <Fly-man-> and then how many does WhiteCore have
[06:08:31] <HanHeld> 2?
[06:08:32] <Fly-man-> K, then I think I made my point ;)
[06:08:36] <Timothy_Hoxley> I don't know thats hidden
[06:08:53] <Fly-man-> For those that wants to know the exact ones:
[06:09:06] <HanHeld> afiak, greythane, Fly-man- and sometimes AI AUstin (maybe?)
[06:09:14] <greythane> ?? not hidden...
[06:09:14] <Fly-man-> greythane is a developer, he maintains the WhiteCore on a Stick
[06:09:50] <Fly-man-> Fly-man- is a developer, I maintain the optional development and where I can I develop on the main
[06:10:02] <Timothy_Hoxley> I plan contributing some code when my hands get untied with my work at zetamex. just hired 2 new support agents, still backed up on work. but i do plan on participating.
[06:10:04] <Fly-man-> There are NO hidden developers
[06:10:18] <Timothy_Hoxley> I am just saying the github page says the developer list is hidden
[06:10:22] <Fly-man-> However, some of the commits that are made through my name
[06:10:43] <Fly-man-> are commits from 2 students, 1 daughter of my RL work co-worker
[06:10:45] <HanHeld> afk a couple mins; brb
[06:11:42] <Timothy_Hoxley> I have a question
[06:12:02] <greythane> Tim, I'm looking at the Github page (WhiteCore-Dev) and all members, contributers etc are visible.
[06:12:10] <Fly-man-> https://github.com/WhiteCoreSim
[06:12:30] <Fly-man-> That shows me and greythane as members of the Development team
[06:12:35] <Fly-man-> Nothing more, nothing less
[06:12:45] <Timothy_Hoxley> I was told by skidz that there was XML-RPC RemoteAdmin support in aurora-sim was that stuff brought over, most of zetamex tools rely on XML-RPC
[06:12:45] <Raider73> if I can offer at some stage I am a technical writer by trade, so if required i would be more than happy to write some documents for whitecore
[06:13:44] <EmperorStarfinde> it does only show you fly
[06:13:52] <greythane> Tim, The XML stuff is still there (I think) but there is no sigh of a remote admin module.. that appears to have been removed for Aurora a while ago
[06:13:57] <EmperorStarfinde> the commits show greythane
[06:14:22] <greythane> It shows me.. but maybe becaue I am logged in.. ;)
[06:14:30] <Timothy_Hoxley> ok greythane, I will look at coding that back in so our companies tools can hook into and other can take advantage of it.
[06:14:36] <EmperorStarfinde> https://github.com/orgs/WhiteCoreSim/people
[06:14:44] <Timothy_Hoxley> yeah it only show fly-man- too me as well
[06:15:10] * Timothy_Hoxley why zetamex has moved to our own gitlab on company servers
[06:15:40] <greythane> OK.. my problem.. now public... Not really up with all the Github stuff
[06:15:47] <Fly-man-> That's because greythane has not set himself as public
[06:15:51] <Fly-man-> and I can't change that for him
[06:16:11] <Timothy_Hoxley> I still find git itself confusing sometimes, I miss subversion :D
[06:16:31] <greythane> Noooo... just got the guys at work to start moving that out...
[06:16:32] <HanHeld> I like github, I can comprehend it; unlike mercurial or subversion
[06:16:52] <greythane> don't get me started... :)
[06:16:56] <Timothy_Hoxley> lol
[06:17:23] <Timothy_Hoxley> http://sourcetreeapp.com/ <-- best git/mercurial client ever
[06:17:25] <HanHeld> mind you, pulling a repo is pretty universal, I guess...
[06:17:37] <HanHeld> I haven't had to merge or fork or anything
[06:17:45] <EmperorStarfinde> i use tortoisegit
[06:18:26] <Timothy_Hoxley> yeah I am still trying to get my staff to learn how to branch code, instead of just making folders in the master branch *face palm*
[06:18:28] <Fly-man-> Timothy_Hoxley: I agree on that one
[06:18:32] <greythane> git reset... is your friend... use it constantly :)
[06:18:33] <Raider73> sourcetree is da best
[06:19:12] <HanHeld> One sec
[06:19:19] <HanHeld> I have a request but I have to look up the web page lol
[06:19:23] <Timothy_Hoxley> just wish they had a linux client
[06:20:06] <HanHeld> I sorta follow openindiana/opensolaris, and their IRC channel uses echelon to log their IRC channel
[06:20:07] <Timothy_Hoxley> but then again i pay for microsoft office and use it in a win7 vm on my desktop so I am one to talk xD
[06:20:19] <HanHeld> The address for their log is http://echelog.com/logs/browse/openindiana/1407189600
[06:20:51] <HanHeld> echelog, I guess (i'm tired, as I said); can y'all set up something similar for this channel?
[06:20:55] <EmperorStarfinde> im suprised you dont use openoffice
[06:21:18] <Timothy_Hoxley> I would use libreoffice before I touch an apache product
[06:21:38] <HanHeld> I use what comes with mint...half the time I use nvi :3
[06:21:40] <EmperorStarfinde> i dont think openoffice is apache
[06:21:43] <Fly-man-> Okay
[06:21:49] <Fly-man-> Since we are now strolling a but
[06:21:53] <Timothy_Hoxley> openoffice is apache
[06:21:55] <Fly-man-> back to the round table ;)
[06:21:58] <Timothy_Hoxley> ok
[06:22:06] <HanHeld> Fly-man-: hopefully you caught my request there
[06:22:09] <Fly-man-> EmperorStarfinde: Any findings, problems, issues you encountered
[06:22:18] <Fly-man-> HanHeld: yes, waiting for that URL
[06:22:34] *** Timothy_Hoxley is now known as brb_Timothy_Hoxl
[06:22:55] <HanHeld> I pasted it, the main page (which lists different channels) is http://echelog.com/
[06:23:43] <Fly-man-> Ahh, okay. I will pass it over to greythane if you don't mind
[06:23:48] <HanHeld> That site might not allow us, tho ("NOTICE Due to a lot of hit'n'miss, you need to avg at least 10 people on a channel before requesting logging.")
[06:23:59] <HanHeld> sounds good, Fly-man-
[06:24:01] <Fly-man-> as I think he has a thing that keeps his chat open 24/7
[06:24:06] *** brb_Timothy_Hoxl is now known as Timothy_Hoxley
[06:24:30] <greythane> .. also logs it so if any needs it... :)
[06:25:04] <EmperorStarfinde> what is the timer set at in the CAPS messaging if known
[06:25:45] <greythane> 2.5 secs springs to mind... for somewhere.. probe=ably seen when trying to chase something through..
[06:26:04] <EmperorStarfinde> hmmm
[06:26:32] <EmperorStarfinde> might explain why i see all those messaging timeouts then
[06:26:49] <Fly-man-> Anything else EmperorStarfinde ?
[06:27:54] <greythane> OK.. where are we at? what annoys you most that must be fixed before we lock the door for the release
[06:28:21] <greythane> timeouts... I need some details here
[06:28:58] <greythane> logs are good... even screen caps of an error are informative
[06:29:00] <HanHeld> My bug-bear was the terrain/oar issue, I haven't found anything else since then.
[06:30:25] <Timothy_Hoxley> my biggest issue is if the server restarts, all the regions must be restarted they will not resync up automatically.
[06:30:32] *** Quits: HanHeld (~me@207-160-42-72.gci.net) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[06:30:33] <EmperorStarfinde> the missing water texture issue has been narrowed down to a missing default texture for those who have very low graphics settings by default
[06:31:10] <greythane> Ok, so we need to add in a lowrez texture then?
[06:31:13] <Timothy_Hoxley> emperorstarfinde that was an issue in opensim for a while too, we just need to get that default texture put into the default iar
[06:31:17] <EmperorStarfinde> maybe
[06:31:34] *** Joins: HanHeld (~me@207-160-42-72.gci.net)
[06:31:43] <EmperorStarfinde> because we had the region owner up her graphics to medium and she was fine
[06:31:54] <HanHeld> That was fun, did I miss much?
[06:32:05] <Timothy_Hoxley> no just talking about a water texture bug
[06:32:16] <greythane> Noted... I'll check it out and add it
[06:32:34] <Timothy_Hoxley> awesome, it should be fixed by just adding iit
[06:32:36] <Timothy_Hoxley> it*
[06:32:58] <greythane> I'm taking note here... :)
[06:33:36] <Fly-man-> I'll throw in a bone for those hungry people: The RealEstate Owner (Basically the main character) now has a face and a body
[06:33:42] <Fly-man-> Showed last week
[06:33:43] <EmperorStarfinde> and the inventory transfer between people on different regions greythane i can reproduce locally in windows my grid is on a windows 2012 server so ill do a bit more testing to see what i can find as its not passing an actual error
[06:34:01] <Fly-man-> Some adjustments have been made and she will have a nice shirt and jeans and some pretty hair
[06:34:13] <Timothy_Hoxley> lol
[06:34:31] <greythane> EmperorStar.. I tried this today and had no problems.. so yes, need some setup and error details if possible
[06:34:39] <Fly-man-> and here is another thing:
[06:34:56] <Fly-man-> At this moment, there will be NO default avatars in the release version of WhiteCore
[06:35:09] <greythane> OH?
[06:35:10] <Fly-man-> I think any grid owner can make a pretty standard AV
[06:35:11] <EmperorStarfinde> ill send you what ive got config wise
[06:35:28] <HanHeld> and load it with an IAR at startup?
[06:35:29] <greythane> thanks.. I'' try and duplicate it
[06:35:34] <Fly-man-> But before greythane has it's OH moment
[06:35:48] <Fly-man-> We will include a set of royalty free textures
[06:35:53] <Fly-man-> donated to me
[06:35:58] <Fly-man-> as standard skins
[06:35:59] <Fly-man-> :P
[06:36:23] <Timothy_Hoxley> I know its kinda dated, but the zadaroo stuff is CC0
[06:36:32] <Fly-man-> Yup
[06:36:40] <greythane> Ok... not so bad, but there does need to be a default avie setup somewhere otherwise it will be the dreaded 'cloud'
[06:37:03] <EmperorStarfinde> or that dreaded default avatar that opensim has
[06:37:09] <greythane> Not everyone will take the time to setup system avies...
[06:37:11] <Fly-man-> Yes, the default AV that when you haven't picked anything
[06:37:14] <Timothy_Hoxley> Well my experience has been whitecore has done a pretty good job of giving me a nice ruth
[06:37:22] <Fly-man-> will just be a WhiteCore standard AV
[06:37:29] <Fly-man-> usually female
[06:37:34] <greythane> I was about to change that today but got sidetracked... agian.. :)
[06:37:40] <Fly-man-> Kinda like Simona Stick is
[06:37:55] <HanHeld> Frankly, I'm miffed they removed ruth from the viewer to begin with...I wonder if she's still in the source for 0.19...
[06:38:09] <Fly-man-> HanHeld: Ruth is still around
[06:38:22] <Fly-man-> only her textures aren't being referenced anymore
[06:38:23] <HanHeld> Fly-man-: ok, I musta read wrong then
[06:38:27] <greythane> Ruth is still there... still the default when nothing else will do. :)
[06:39:12] <Fly-man-> The reason why I personally think there shouldn't be a Default
[06:39:22] <Fly-man-> as each grid will likely have their own feeling about it
[06:39:33] <Fly-man-> and with supplying some basic textures in the Library
[06:39:41] <Fly-man-> I think that will help people be creative
[06:40:01] <Timothy_Hoxley> well if I am not incorrect here, you can setup a selection of starters using the web interface
[06:40:12] <Fly-man-> Timothy_Hoxley: When you made them yourself ;)
[06:40:13] <EmperorStarfinde> well you dont want them rezzing in as a cloud the very first time but yes grid owners usually will have their default avatar preferences beyond that initial period
[06:40:14] <greythane> Correct.. and this works fine..
[06:40:16] <Timothy_Hoxley> right
[06:40:48] <Fly-man-> And remember, and I can't emphasizes this enough:
[06:40:49] <greythane> There still needs to be basic avatars to build on though... That's all I was referring to...
[06:40:56] <Fly-man-> WhiteCore is NOT for dummies ;)
[06:41:20] <greythane> er.. maybe.. but it is pretty close :)
[06:41:28] <Fly-man-> greythane: In the Optional repo I will create some IAR's for basic AV's
[06:41:36] <Fly-man-> it's up to people to implement them
[06:41:42] <HanHeld> it's ...not? I'll get my coat :3
[06:41:50] <Fly-man-> or we could even make a new repo with just things like that
[06:41:56] <HanHeld> seriously, I was telling someone on SLU today
[06:42:06] <HanHeld> Only get into it if you're ready to help test and report bugs
[06:42:14] <Fly-man-> Correct
[06:42:21] <greythane> mind you , some will not learn..
[06:42:23] <Fly-man-> Opensim has a load of peoplev
[06:42:29] <Fly-man-> and WhiteCore is small
[06:42:43] <Fly-man-> in the end, Opensim has a lot of people complaining
[06:42:50] <Fly-man-> and we get some of those people
[06:42:51] <Timothy_Hoxley> osgrid and whitecore help grab the testers providing pre-compiled builds with a grid already to connect too
[06:43:01] <Timothy_Hoxley> osgrid is practically opensim's debug ground zero
[06:43:14] <Fly-man-> Timothy_Hoxley: And there's 1 large difference
[06:43:21] <Fly-man-> WhiteCore set a record:
[06:43:31] <Fly-man-> We have released more snapshots in 8 months
[06:43:41] <Fly-man-> then Opensim has ever in 6 years
[06:44:01] <Timothy_Hoxley> yeah I know, mean I personally just started offering weekly builds for people
[06:44:06] <Fly-man-> and I am not counting the OSGrid ones
[06:44:06] <EmperorStarfinde> well whitecore is more organized as well
[06:44:21] <Timothy_Hoxley> well to whitecore's advantage its a smaller team
[06:44:31] <Fly-man-> But that's also a crux to many
[06:44:36] <Fly-man-> there's not a large team that does things
[06:44:42] <Fly-man-> so yeah, sometimes things go slower
[06:44:56] <Fly-man-> and many of the Opensim developers are RL involved in it
[06:45:01] <HanHeld> then again, many large teams do nothing ...exactly because they're large :3
[06:45:12] <Fly-man-> HanHeld: Small teams the same ;)
[06:45:14] <Fly-man-> HanHeld:
[06:45:29] <Fly-man-> but yes, we allow people to see progress
[06:45:39] <HanHeld> I bounce back and forth between Arriba, Opensim and Aurorasim, on a technical level I don't have any gripes with any of them
[06:45:44] <Fly-man-> and a big thanks to greythane for making it so we only have to push a BIN folder
[06:45:45] <HanHeld> of course, I'm just an ameteur so
[06:45:47] <EmperorStarfinde> the size of the team doesnt matter in the do nothing category it has to do more with being organized and focused
[06:45:51] <Fly-man-> and all the configuration things are good
[06:46:04] <HanHeld> Yeah, that's a HUGE help, being able to have a stationary set of ini files
[06:46:06] <Fly-man-> because that made a lot of work earier
[06:46:09] <HanHeld> makes things tons less confusing
[06:46:15] <Fly-man-> easier in maintaining a grid
[06:46:25] <Fly-man-> and when doing rolling restarts, the regions are down less often
[06:46:34] <Fly-man-> and shorter times
[06:46:46] <EmperorStarfinde> yes that is better
[06:47:08] <HanHeld> Well, I don't have anything to offer, it's almost 3am where I'm at, so I'm gonna log
[06:47:11] <Fly-man-> And I think having WoaS as a backup plan for those that really have no clue
[06:47:15] <HanHeld> Nice seein all y'all :)
[06:47:20] <Fly-man-> HanHeld: Have a good sleep
[06:47:20] * Timothy_Hoxley favorite feature of whitecore is no database for regions
[06:47:32] <HanHeld> Fly-man-: thanks :)
[06:47:41] <Fly-man-> WoaS has also made it easier for new people to enter
[06:47:42] *** Parts: HanHeld (~me@207-160-42-72.gci.net) ()
[06:47:44] <greythane> Thanks HanHeld..
[06:47:46] <EmperorStarfinde> i like the file backup system better to
[06:47:58] <Fly-man-> and the FileBased loading of regions
[06:48:11] <Fly-man-> and being able to see when a texture is broken
[06:48:13] <Fly-man-> or even missing
[06:48:32] <EmperorStarfinde> if you know what texture the uuid is referring to
[06:48:35] <Fly-man-> In the past 8 months we did things that should have already been in Opensim ages ago
[06:48:52] <Timothy_Hoxley> I worked with francisco to make the postgresql backend for opensim, because I can't tell you how often mysql starts to choke on opensim.
[06:49:12] <Fly-man-> Timothy_Hoxley: I never has my database server choke
[06:49:22] <Fly-man-> and I am using the TokuDB engine
[06:49:39] <Fly-man-> which compresses the database to a 10% of a normal MySQL/ISAM/INNODB
[06:50:02] <Fly-man-> In went 2 Gb of MySQL
[06:50:03] <Timothy_Hoxley> i like postgresql and how its more acid compliant and has healing abilities
[06:50:10] <Fly-man-> out came 219 Mb of TokuDB
[06:50:19] <Fly-man-> Main reason why we don't have a connector for it:
[06:50:26] <Fly-man-> We don't need a connector
[06:50:28] <Fly-man-> it's just MySQL
[06:50:29] <Fly-man-> but faster
[06:50:55] <Timothy_Hoxley> you want to know something funny, when we fired up the postgresql opensim build we made and we couldn't figure out why it kept spitting out all these errors
[06:50:55] <EmperorStarfinde> so curious does the aurora-webui work with whitecore
[06:51:09] <Timothy_Hoxley> we had to fix over 65 acid compiant issues in opensim xD
[06:51:33] <Fly-man-> EmperorStarfinde: No clue, I haven't touched any Aurora stuff since Jan
[06:51:50] <Timothy_Hoxley> in theory it should
[06:51:57] <greythane> I don't think it has worked with Aurora for quite a while... bu I might be wrong :)
[06:52:06] <EmperorStarfinde> ok that answers that then ill just rewrite the webui and add forums and all that into its integration
[06:52:27] <EmperorStarfinde> it did greythane but it stopped about may last year working fully correctly
[06:52:40] <greythane> ok
[06:53:06] <EmperorStarfinde> i always wound up having to go through that coding just to find the bugs with the user login every time there was an update
[06:53:35] <Fly-man-> Concluding the meeting:
[06:53:46] <Fly-man-> If you find ANY bugs, put them in the issue tracker
[06:53:58] <Fly-man-> We're aiming to freeze the development for 0.9.2 mid September
[06:54:16] <Fly-man-> so we can release 0.9.2 at the end of September
[06:54:43] <Fly-man-> I plan to hold these meetings every Tuesday at the same time
[06:54:55] <Fly-man-> BUT since this could also be a problem for people that have to work
[06:55:10] <Fly-man-> I'd like to hear suggestions from people what other time would be a good one
[06:55:23] <Fly-man-> Do remember, for greythane it's almost night time
[06:55:47] <Fly-man-> and personally I like to have greythane here when we hold these meetings
[06:56:03] <EmperorStarfinde> i have alot of testing plans today
[06:56:18] <Fly-man-> The chatlog of this meeting will be compiled
[06:56:23] <greythane> almost :)...
[06:56:40] <Fly-man-> and then put up on either Google+ or other place
[06:56:59] <EmperorStarfinde> a good thing to put in the documentation there to
[06:57:03] <Fly-man-> Thank you all for coming and listening
[06:57:15] <Fly-man-> - END chatlog -
[06:57:21] <Timothy_Hoxley> is there anything you think I should emphasize in my grid-press article on this meeting?
[06:57:31] <greythane> Let's not mess up Sarge's G+ page with logs etc... maybe a 'dev' page or...?
[06:57:37] <Fly-man-> Timothy_Hoxley: That's up to you
[06:57:56] <greythane> What do you need Tim?
[06:58:01] <Fly-man-> greythane: on the website ?
[06:58:06] <Fly-man-> with a link in the G+
[06:58:09] <greythane> can do...
[06:58:17] <EmperorStarfinde> can put them on whitecore-sim.org really and then post a link to each meeting log on google+
[06:58:29] <Timothy_Hoxley> I was just wanting to know if you guys wanted me to make any statements, but I do plan on quoting fly-man- about whitecore is not for dummies
[06:59:37] <greythane> er, fine.. but that is not my ideal... :) I am trying to make this as 'idiot proff' as possible but it is a complicated system and some knowledge is beneficial
[06:59:58] <Fly-man-> Timothy_Hoxley: I have no issues with that quote
[07:00:07] <Fly-man-> as long as it's not being pulled out of context
[07:00:37] <Timothy_Hoxley> I agree with Fly-Man- right now its still pretty early and its not like opensim yet where its pretty much uncomment a file and go unless they use your simonastick version
[07:00:40] <greythane> The 'to do' list appears to be fairly short so I just need to sort out some file issues tha I found today, fix up the inventory and then start housecleaning if necessary ready for the winter... :)
[07:01:25] <greythane> Tim, right now, you can clone, build and run without changing anything at all... to do the extras is some small editing..
[07:01:31] <EmperorStarfinde> is the terrain code pretty stable at this point as far as decoding and all that
[07:01:48] <Fly-man-> EmperorStarfinde: I don't see any changes that we need to make to the terrain code
[07:02:10] <Timothy_Hoxley> greythane: while that is true for me or you, if someone else like say mike was to do this he would get lost on what to configure becuase the lack of documentation.
[07:02:26] <Fly-man-> Timothy_Hoxley: And documentation is indeed on the list of things
[07:02:33] <EmperorStarfinde> no i was asking as i wanted to be sure decoding for terrain was where it is intended to be before i start work on my hollowing features
[07:02:44] <greythane> I have not found any further problems.. though it might be beneficial to be able to load jpg terrains if needed... but there is already an inbuilt terrain generator that will do almost anything you need
[07:02:46] <Fly-man-> but at this moment, I'd rather see a release out with working things
[07:03:12] <Fly-man-> then someone writing a book "How to setup WhteCore" with 20 pages of text explaining what each command does
[07:03:19] <Timothy_Hoxley> so would you guys say 0.9.2 is going to be a pretty stable release?
[07:03:36] <Fly-man-> I think in Ubuntu terms:
[07:03:40] <Fly-man-> 0.9.2 is a LTS
[07:03:47] <greythane> oh.. ok.. no I have no plans to modify the terrain at all... even though the current painting does annoy me a bit, but I can live with that
[07:03:57] <Fly-man-> Long Term Stable
[07:04:34] <Timothy_Hoxley> so will you be like opensim does and back port fixes to it in a post-fix fashion? if bug fixes come along that are back portable?
[07:04:49] <EmperorStarfinde> ok so once i do some more testing on the inventory ill start working on that feature
[07:05:45] <greythane> I would rather progress on an upgrade path where the fixes are applied to a 'new' version that is backwards compatible with existing data
[07:06:29] <Timothy_Hoxley> so in other words keep like a stable branch and dev branch
[07:07:05] <greythane> All the 'fixes' that I do are pretty well tested before they get pushed out so the 'dev' repo is basically beta-stable, just changing
[07:07:10] <Fly-man-> as greythane says, the snapshots are our stabled
[07:07:28] <Fly-man-> as soon as they go out on Mondays
[07:07:35] <Fly-man-> people can upgrade their systems
[07:07:46] <Fly-man-> and start pushing issues
[07:08:01] <Timothy_Hoxley> ok, well thanks for the info I am going to go finish my sleep. then getup and push out an article for you guys on grid-press
[07:08:10] <Fly-man-> those will/hope to get a fix between Tuesday and Sunday
[07:08:17] <Fly-man-> so next Monday the fixes are in

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Categories: General
Tagged: Development